.

Tuesday, May 5, 2009

Darwin, creationism
Hot Topics: A Judge Rules SoCal teacher violated First Amendment


Posted at 5/05/2009 11:00:00 AM
Categories

35 comments:

  1. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:01 PM

    It's Hot or That's Hot! Just how hot is it?!

    ReplyDelete
  2. texasmama1015/5/09, 1:10 PM

    joy rocks!

    and whats with bitsy saying to joy "i think a genral deserves a little more respect than that"
    if she is so pro war why dont she take her ass over there and start fighting it!

    she wants to act all mighty rediclus "patriotic" about the war
    geeze

    poor sherry she still thinks the earth is flat

    ReplyDelete
  3. yeji5/5/09, 1:10 PM

    i love joys necklace .... just so cheerful looking.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:25 PM

    I'm in Joy's world, and I stand by her statement too. Not teaching your child science, math, language, and history when you have the opportunity is child abuse. You are hindering them in the real world, even if you have good intentions.

    You cannot teach creation and science together because one is religion and the other is science. The idea of teaching science in Sunday school is ridiculous, so why is the idea of teaching creationism/ID in school seen as acceptable, even by [usually] rational people like Whoopi?

    Unless you want scientists in churches, stay out of my science class.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:25 PM

    Question for View fanatics - did Barbara always have such a big role in the earlier seasons of the show? It seems like she's on the panel of an average of 3 shows out of 5. Her credentials as a broadcaster deserve respect but my God, she really slows the conversation down. She takes so long to spit out her point. Elizabeth, for all her warped viewpoints, is at least articulate and there is a good flow of conversation. Barbara is shaky and stutters her way through.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:40 PM

    It's called separation of church and state - you cannot teach a particular religion in a public schoo, period. Creationism is not scientific. If Elizabeth is so concerned about her child learning about it, then, as she said, she and other parents should teach their children - she should not be pushing it into public classrooms.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:42 PM

    I completely agree that it is child abuse to not teach children scientific fact. It seems very cult-like to indoctrinate them with select and often unfounded viewpoints, based on antiquated stories and ideas.
    I know that Joy's statement was bold, but it was amazingly refreshing to hear.
    Elizabeth needs to take it easy.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:47 PM

    p.s. Listening to religious fanatics that think that the world is flat makes me want to throw up. Does anyone else have that reaction?

    ReplyDelete
  9. jayare5/5/09, 1:52 PM

    not so long ago some "educationalists" brought up this point in my country, Poland: is Darwinism bogus? I'm a Catholic myself but can't understand how it's possible to argue that the only way to interpret the Bible is to do it LITERALLY. BTW: isn't it annoying how Bitsy's ALWAYS trying to be 'politically correct' and make up straw-men arguments just to defend some silly views?

    ReplyDelete
  10. Anonymous5/5/09, 1:55 PM

    Darwinism is SCIENCE based on FACTS. So you teach it in science class. Creationism is based on FAITH so teach that in religion class. But do not bring in creationism into science class! Science has to be proven and generate a consensus amongst the sicentific community which creationism has not at all!

    Also Elizabeth and Sherri are over-reacting. In my high school (about 5 years ago), teachers gave their opinions on the world wars in history class, on novels in english class - so what's wrong with a science teacher giving his opinion on creationism in science class?

    ReplyDelete
  11. Kevin5/5/09, 2:58 PM

    I agree with Joy, not teaching your children science IS a kind of child abuse. You are depriving them of their right to an education.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Unknown5/5/09, 3:06 PM

    Lester, thanks again for the postings! Do you think you could do the Larry King Interviews of the View ladies, he's doing all this week? Tonight is Joy!

    Would be fabulous if you had the time too.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Unknown5/5/09, 4:09 PM

    Joy is the only one speaking sense in this discussion, even Whoopi's view is objectionable as far as I'm concered. There's no room for creationism in a science class, there's no scientific basis for it. Well done to Joy for the rational thought. Barbara's contribution was "it's a hot topic", yes that's why it's in the hot topics section.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Hieu5/5/09, 4:47 PM

    texasmama101, she is just saying a general should have respect, would you give a general respect? of course you would! shes not dissing joy off or anything

    ReplyDelete
  15. David5/5/09, 4:59 PM

    This whole discussion about Creationism and Darwinism being taught in the public schools WASN'T EVEN THE QUESTION THEY WERE FIRST TALKING ABOUT. The question was whether the teacher was violating the First Amendment by showing "hostility towards a religion" because he works for the government. According to most local laws (which are stemming from the First Amendment) teachers/school officials are NOT allowed to outwardly condemn or support a specific religion.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Anonymous5/5/09, 7:45 PM

    God created the world through science.

    END OF STORY!

    Darwanism is STILL just a theory. There are still a lot of holes in it that throw the entire thing off, SOOOO the teacher should not be allowed to give his opinion when teaching, PERIOD, and Joy is wrong for the child abuse comment. It was almost as dumb as Sherri taking the Bible literally. Geez!.... GET A GRIP PEOPLE!

    ReplyDelete
  17. A5/5/09, 8:40 PM

    Real Proof of Evolution: Incontrovertible, blatantly obvious when it is finally explained.

    Real Proof of God: Nonexistent.

    Whoopi really disappointed me this time, creationism should never accompany evolution. Leave the explanation of it's ancient ideals to the rich religious leaders.

    ReplyDelete
  18. Anonymous5/5/09, 9:19 PM

    Did anyone ever think about maybe perhaps evolution and creationism goes hand in hand? There is a heaven to gain and a hell to shun and the bible is the truth. Creation is truth but don't you think that evolution is the process of how God created the heavens and the earth? What do you think?

    ReplyDelete
  19. Anonymous5/5/09, 9:23 PM

    I don't get the Anonymous 7:45pm's comment. Yes evolution is a theory. We also have the theory of gravity. And the theory of relativity (recall Einstein). Are we going to stop teaching gravity in school beacause it's a theory. The english/public definition of theory is NOT the same as a scientific theory.

    Plus you say that the theory of evolution has holes. Well if we're talking about holes, Creationism as so many holes you can drive a car through it! Dinosaurs anyone?

    ReplyDelete
  20. Anonymous5/5/09, 9:25 PM

    I have read all the comments and I feel the need to make one myself. I am a firm believer in the Bible, I KNOW God is real. I am thankful for the Christ dying for my sins and being raised from the dead with all power!!! Those are my beliefs, but as a Science teacher I do not express my beliefs in class, that is not the place. I don't even answer the question when students ask bc I don't want a heated debate. So I am in complete agreement with Elizabeth (the 1st time ever!!!) That as a government woker there is a separation of church and state, and I honor that.

    NOw I do believe that God created that world and I don't have to defend or justify that, I do take the bible literally bc if I don't then why read it, or say Im a Christian, it makes no sense to only partially believe. But what I don't do as a Christian is to try to convert people I respect everybody and everybody will not believe in God and Jesus and its not my job to make them. So as a Christian I expect the same respect from someone who doesn't share my views, thats why this is called America!!

    ReplyDelete
  21. Anonymous5/5/09, 9:33 PM

    Anonymous 9:25 PM, I understand that you respect other people by not converting them but don't you believe in witnessing to other people and telling people about the gospel?

    ReplyDelete
  22. Anonymous5/5/09, 9:45 PM

    I agree with everyone who said evolution belongs in the science classroom and creationism belongs in the church. Even in my school, which was a Catholic school, we learned evolution in Science class and Creationism in religion class. Then we were left to make our own decisions about which one or what mix of the two we believed.

    As someone who is planning to teach in public schools, I would never think to bring Creationism into the classroom, whether to teach it or to dismiss it as the teacher they are discussing did.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Anonymous5/6/09, 3:10 AM

    Anonymous 9:45pm - I could not agree more.

    Both creationism and evolution deserve to be a part of a school curriculum. However - evolution belongs in science class, creationism belongs in religious education class. Simple.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Anonymous5/6/09, 4:02 AM

    u.s is weird. faith should be separated from secular science class.

    i always look at science as a logical explaination for god's process of creation. but that being said, science is science, faith is faith. science is logic, faith is personal beliefs.

    ReplyDelete
  25. Anonymous5/6/09, 6:41 AM

    The teacher was correct. Creationism is religious nonsense. A teacher owes no respect to religious superstitions I'm with Joy on this one. Indeed, in the ideal world teachers are to disabuse students of ignorance and superstition. The idea of an education is to rid yourself of deception and superstition, rather than protect and honor them. I am sick and tired of bible bashers trying to impose their way of thinking and how things should be done according to the man made book, which has no foundation nothing more than a book that belongs in the fiction section. I read little red riding hood once, don't mean I believe there is a wolf in grannies clothing waiting to eat my azz in a house in the woods... The bible is MAN WRITTEN... A book of nothing more than stories and its NOT to be taken litteraly... and to the guy/gal who said jesus died for your sins your full of it, he died because of people like you who condemed & crucified a man who brought a different way of thinking the more loving God and not some "dictator vengefull jelouse God" as scribed by the bible bashers of his day. The explanation for the lack of "GOD" intervention was scribed as well he had to die because....(ponders)..... oh yeah your sins... puhleaz!! I think if Jesus was alive now and if you would have asked him if you went back in time would you die for sins of man...he would have said umm okay I die for your sins??? pffttt I'll choose to live and keep track of mine and let GOD hold YOU accountable for your own shit... and keep spreading my message.

    ReplyDelete
  26. Anonymous5/6/09, 6:55 AM

    theory is not fact, people...seems to me like y'all are scientific fanatics. i agree we should not teach a specific religion in schools, but let's be clear - by positing science as the only possible way of understanding the world, schools are also indoctrinating students into a specific, exclusive epistemology (way of knowing). whether the Pope, Jesus, or Darwin, we are all deferring to the ideas of one man in deterministic ways, and I find it all problematic.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Navido5/6/09, 7:53 AM

    I agree with Joy

    ReplyDelete
  28. Anonymous5/6/09, 8:23 AM

    I LOVE WHOOPI! SHE PLAYED ELISABETH!

    ReplyDelete
  29. Anonymous5/6/09, 10:43 AM

    Joy made the most sense this time around. Darwinism should be taught in science class. Creationism belongs in religious education.

    However, it's kind of narrow minded to equal creationism to darwinism, saying they are just as important. Darwinism should be taught by default, since it lacks bias towards any religion. It's pretty much neutral in terms of faith.

    Creationism and other Christian views should be taught as well, but so should the basics of any other worldly religion! For some reason, it seems that many Americans value the teachings of Christianity over every other religion. Information about all religions should be taught in school at an equal level, without favouring either one. They should not be taught as fact, however.

    I also have one keyword for everyone who believes that creationism should be taught as fact in school; DINOSAURS.

    ReplyDelete
  30. Carolien (Netherlands)5/6/09, 11:09 AM

    I feel that the subject of Creationism being taught in school has evolved from ideology to indoctrination. There is very little room for discussion. Are kids allowed to question Creationism as freely as they can Darwins theory ? To question even Gods existence already seems a hot topic in the US.

    When I hear this kind of discussions I always wonder... where did God come from ? Did he have parents ?

    ReplyDelete
  31. Anonymous5/6/09, 12:13 PM

    I believe in science and in the importance of teaching it. In my opinion, though, I think it requires MORE faith to think that the complexity of this universe happened all by chance than to believe that a higher being was behind its creation.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Unknown5/6/09, 12:31 PM

    THE U.S. constitution requires separation of church and state for many good reasons.
    The teach could at best, say to the students comments, they are not appropriate in a public school.
    For the teacher to discuss ANY RELIGION in a PUBLIC classroom is not appropriate, whether or not the teacher is correct. ;0)

    ReplyDelete
  33. Dan-Sognatore5/7/09, 11:43 AM

    I myself belive in both - darwinism and creationism, but in PARTS - on the one hand, the origin of the Earth is scientificly proven, and I respect that, but there's also some things, in a person's life, which can only be called "unexplainable" - things what science STILL can't explain, and therefore a person obviously turns to something greater - A God, if you may, depending on the religion. So one could say, that for most of us, the life we live is a combination, of both.

    But, yeah, I also agree, that those two aspects, can not be teached, alongside as absolute, cause they would zero each other out, on the fundamentals.

    ReplyDelete
  34. Anonymous5/9/09, 2:53 AM

    Riddle me this, why is it every time Ms. Barbara talk do it seem like she about to fall asleep or like she got a alzheimers an can’t remember what she was about to say…. Ok she‘s old but I‘m saying it’s time to retire cause that’s so annoying… Joy is right.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Unknown5/29/09, 7:25 AM

    Religion and Science can't co-exist because religion is full of shit. I agree with Joy's comments about freedom of religion in school. And I think it is child abuse if you don't teach your children competing views. Elizabeth just wants to indoctrinate everyone with her crazy views. Everyone notice how Whoopi got pissed with Elizawreck for interrupting? HHAHAHA

    ReplyDelete

Subscribe to: Post Comments (Atom)